Should my zucchini/straight squash be leaning over the EB & touching the ground

[ctplanter]

Should my zucchini/straight squash be leaning over the EB & touching the ground?  How can I better support my zucchini and straight squash?  They look like they're falling out the sides of the earthbox and might pull or break the main stalks. 

If you're looking at the Earthbox with the widest part going from left to right and the shorter part going from "far" to "near", the squash is on the right side on the "far" and "near" sides (with the fertilizer strip in the middle).  The top squash seems to be leaning over the far side and the near squash seems to be leaning over the near side.  There's space in the middle and they're not too over extended to the right side (though I had hoped they would move in this direction).  I have peppers to the left and while there's been some leaves overshadowing the peppers,  I used some gardening twine and 4 stakes around the squash to help train the leaves from overshadowing the peppers.  (I can't find the original post I found weeks ago which gave me the idea)

However, I haven't figured out a good way to use the gardening twine to better support all of the stems which have leaned/fallen out onto the sides and terrace floor.  The main stem of one of the plants already seems weak  (Please see my post "Are these vine borers" and I don't know if it was just a broken stem that is unsuccessfully trying to repair itself or what.  I'm just beginning to get fruit so the plant will just get heavier.  Are they meant to sweep the floor?  Should I not worry about breakage?

Please advise.  Thank you!

[morganmac]

Mine are doing the same thing. I staked one plant up a bit so it wouldn't block the watering tube, but I think it's inevitable that they're going to flop on the ground. They're an ant highway right now, which is kind of worrisome, but I haven't seen any evidence of other pests.

I remember seeing a post from bdank, I think, where she used a piece of wire mesh (like for concrete reinforcement) bent over the EB so the squash had an elevated horizontal trellis-type setup. Of course, that was probably put into place when the plants were tiny...but maybe something similar could be done now? I can't seem to locate the post or I'd link to it. I'm sure someone else will be able to help.

[cushman350]

Something like this?

[PaulB]

I have grown green and yellow zuchinni, butternut, straight and crookneck squash and have never used a trellis, it just hangs over the edge of the box and eventually on the ground.  The stems on the leaves are hollow and delicate, but the main stem is quite woody and strong.  I have had vines die, but never break from the weight of the squash.  It's growing nature's way, with minimal interference from me.

[Kareneh]

Mine are doing the same thing. I staked one plant up a bit so it wouldn't block the watering tube, but I think it's inevitable that they're going to flop on the ground. They're an ant highway right now, which is kind of worrisome, but I haven't seen any evidence of other pests.

I remember seeing a post from bdank, I think, where she used a piece of wire mesh (like for concrete reinforcement) bent over the EB so the squash had an elevated horizontal trellis-type setup. Of course, that was probably put into place when the plants were tiny...but maybe something similar could be done now? I can't seem to locate the post or I'd link to it. I'm sure someone else will be able to help.

There is a photo of this here

http://forum.earthbox.com/index.php?topic=7378.75

[mjb8743]

When my boxes were on the ground, the plants leaned over and the strong leaf stems provided support. When I raised the boxes on 8" concrete blocks, the first season they flopped over, and their weight pulled them out of the mix... I needed some support. I found my planting configuration needed to change.

Instead of planting the squash fairly close to the edge to keep them away from the center fert strip, I moved the strip to the back edge and shifted the planting holes away from the edges of the box. My squash are happy planted about 1/3 of box width in from the edge. This provides more flat surface support before the vine leans off the edge. This year I will try Cushman's cage as well.

Also, I've found my Cavilli and Sure Thing squashes were so prolific, that this year I'm doing only 2 plants per box, with the fert strip going front-to-back, like some do for tomatoes. I plan to put the EB insect net over the squash to foil the SVB. The only problem will be the hassle of harvesting with the net in the way.

Mickie.

[baileyj]

I am probably the last person to give advice about squash/zucchini as I cannot seem to harvest any the past few years....But I am persistent and keep trying and trying...

I put my fertilizer strip in back to front across the box with the squash about 1/3 in from the side edge.  (I do the same for tomatoes)  I also put in a short stake if the leaves are really huge to give support to the main stem.

The problem listed here I have mastered....now if I could only keep the squash borers and bugs at bay I would have something to harvest..

[mjb8743]

Judi--   

The problem listed here I have mastered....now if I could only keep the squash borers and bugs at bay I would have something to harvest.. 

The Cavilli (light skin zucchini), Sure Thing Zucchini, and Partenon zucchini are all parthenocarpic, so the insect netting can protect them without worrying about pollination... mine did very well on their own without bees or q-tips last year until PM finally did them in. This year I'm adding the netting and will begin spraying weekly.

Mickie

[ctplanter]

Yes, Cushman!  That was the diagram.  However, I have poorly replicated it and it still doesn't really support the majority of the vines that have flopped because they reside below the first rung of the twine and I think it would be very unnatural to try to get the twine under them and to tighten to make them more vertical.  I guess I could try putting some empty pots under them to help try to support them since one of the main stems is already weak.  I probably should have made the stake/twine box earlier in the season.

Morgan, I have tiny ants too!  Should we be worried about the ants?  I'm not sure if they is the cause of the vine split that might have closed into the drying out major stem.   Nobody has answered my post on "Are these vine borers".  I don't know if they're just unable to tell from my photo.  I don't know if I should try to cut the vine open or not.

MJB, I didn't know EB had an insect net.  I think it might be too late for me to get it this season.

Thank you all for your input!

[cushman350]

Anything to stabilize the weak stem. If your boxes on the ground, a garden stake could do it.

Next year try concrete wire arbors. Or, try centering your squash in the box and I was wondering what everyone thought of a full circle fert strip?

[PaulB]

Cushman, I have considered using a thin tulle tube to hold my fertilizer and to place it all around the outside edge in a circle, more or less.  I have the tubes ready but haven't implemented it yet.  This would leave the entire interior of the box surface for planting.  This should do well for short root vegetables such as onions, beets and some carrots.  An experiment for another time....

[baileyj]

Mickie,
Do the cavelli and partenon taste as good ?  Any difference in flavor?  Not sure it matters, I never have a yield so mine are store bought at this point.
Also... what are you spraying them weekly with?  Are you spraying for prevention of PM? bugs ?
Sounds like I need to use nets for what I have.
I ordered partenon and cavelli last night....
Thanks,
Judi

[mjb8743]

Mickie,
Do the cavelli and partenon taste as good ?  Any difference in flavor?  Not sure it matters, I never have a yield so mine are store bought at this point.
Also... what are you spraying them weekly with?  Are you spraying for prevention of PM? bugs ?
Sounds like I need to use nets for what I have.
I ordered partenon and cavelli last night....

I spray with Daconil or Ortho Garden spray containing chlorothalonil, a fungicide. I don't bother trying to spray for squash bugs... hopefully the nets will keep them off my squash, but they usually go everywhere. I use the bugzooka and hunt for the egg clusters to crush. So far, that seems adequate. Thuricide (BT) is my other spray for worms.

An interesting thing I've noticed: every year, it's always the yellow Crookneck squash that gets the PM first, and from there it spreads quickly to the other squash, then to the cukes and melons. If I spray nothing else, the yellow squash will get sprayed.

As for taste of the zucchini, I thought they were good. The Cavilli has a nice nutty flavor... sure beats store-bought.

Mickie

[HJM]

I have been using milk as a fungicide. The first time I encountered powdery mildew it was too late to get to a store once I figured out what it was. I came across a recipe on the web for milk, baking soda, and dish soap. It worked like a charm.

This year, I did some further reading on the web - research studies - which indicated that a 10% milk 90% water mixture acts as both a fungicide and a foliar feeding solution. Skim milk is evidently preferred which is good as it is the only kind in the house. The reason I moved to this from my baking soda mixture is that someone indicated that if the mildew is a constant problem, the amount of baking soda used may eventually impact the taste of the vegetables. I don't know if that part is accurate. Since then, I have stuck with just the diluted skim milk and it does stop powdery mildew dead in its tracks.

For me, it also has the added advantage that I don't have to wait to spray my plants with their regular foliar fertilizer.
HJM

[ctplanter]

Cushman,  thanks!  I mixed peppers in the squash box (which is an Earthbox no no) so that's why I put the strip in the center.  That was the tradeoff for more variety of plants in a limited space with limited time. My primary concern was giving the peppers enough space and keeping the squash from overshadowing them.  I think that part of the design worked.  I had also assumed zucchini was a squash (which I subsequently learned from another thread that for Earthbox purposes it's more like tomatoes - two per box) so I had thought I had more "room"

I'm not sure I understand your arbor design, but I do like the idea of the fertilizer around the perimeter of the box to maximize the Earthbox space.  Space does seem to go quickly.  One of my tomato plants is growing out of control and I'm already using the staking system.  It looks like it has one arm up and one arm forward in addition to the main "body" of the plant.  It's funny how they grow so quickly that by the time I notice, it's too hard to train them/tie them back.