Subsistance Gardening...

[Wandering Rose]

This is a what if  question and it goes back to the idea of BPP and V%. It's a purely hypothetical situation, and relates to nothing I am doing in RL. Although it would be lovely to be in such a situation, I am asking only because  the idea of teaching people to fish. er to food? is such a powerful one to me. (From the old addage...give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day. Teach him to fish and...well you know the rest)

If you were an agricultural advisor to a domestic or foreign aid program and you learned that EB was donating 800 boxes for a startup EB program in a village of 200 people whose primary source of food comes from the beans and yams they grow. The objective of the program is to allow the residents to grow food for their own consumption that will improve the nutritional value of their daily diet.

The climate is hot and dry, the winters are mild and rainfall, sporadic. What would you recommend for crops? What would change if you knew that, for the right program, EB might be convinced to donate 1600 boxes? And by all means, feel free to throw in any other thoughts or considerations you may have.

Of course, having thought about this, I have my own ideas, but I'm curious to see if they coincide with yours.

rose

[mjb8743]

Rose--  Earthbox already is involved in many programs similar to your example. You might get in touch with John who is involved. See this forum section:

http://forum.earthbox.com/index.php?board=11.0

Community Programs
This is where Program Managers at facilities can discuss their programs

Mickie

[movrshakr]

This is a what if  question and it goes back to the idea of BPP and V%. It's a purely hypothetical situation, and relates to nothing I am doing in RL.

BPP?
V%?
RL?

English please.

[kathy]

Rose, you might do a little research on the internet, EarthBox has been teaming up with the American Horticultural Association, the Growing Connection (now called something else) The United Nations, etc, and has been very involved in educating people in Africa etc, about sustainable agriculture. Our Trinidad/Tobago story is a great one.

[Wandering Rose]

Movr shakr...it's a reference to a previous thread of mine on EB 'metrics' and trying to compare them to those given out to sq. ft. gardeners.

Mickie, thank you, I had forgotten about that section of the forum.

Kathy, I love this one:
   
Earth Boxes Experiment Proving Success in Haiti

but I did not see the Trinidad/Tobago story. I will look for it.

rose

[movrshakr]

Movr shakr...it's a reference to a previous thread of mine on EB 'metrics' and trying to compare them to those given out to sq. ft. gardeners...

I saw the other thread, but neither did that define BPP precisely; said it has to do with number of boxes (call it B) and number of people fed from them (call it P).

Is BPP "Boxes per person"?  "Box-person percentage"?  What?

Is it B/P, P/B, P*B?

[writeone]

I'm not following the short hand either, but I skimmed enough to get the general gist of the content.

If Rose wants readers to understand, plain English on this post is necessary. Otherwise, we'll just go with what we do understand.

[cushman350]

This is a what if  question and it goes back to the idea of BPP and V%. It's a purely hypothetical situation, and relates to nothing I am doing in RL.

BPP?
V%?
RL?

English please.

BPP? = Box per Person?
V% = __________? (volume)
RL? = Real Life?

Guessing. 

[cushman350]

This is a what if  question and it goes back to the idea of BPP and V%. It's a purely hypothetical situation, and relates to nothing I am doing in RL. Although it would be lovely to be in such a situation, I am asking only because  the idea of teaching people to fish. er to food? is such a powerful one to me. (From the old addage...give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day. Teach him to fish and...well you know the rest)

If you were an agricultural advisor to a domestic or foreign aid program and you learned that EB was donating 800 boxes for a startup EB program in a village of 200 people whose primary source of food comes from the beans and yams they grow. The objective of the program is to allow the residents to grow food for their own consumption that will improve the nutritional value of their daily diet.

The climate is hot and dry, the winters are mild and rainfall, sporadic. What would you recommend for crops? What would change if you knew that, for the right program, EB might be convinced to donate 1600 boxes? And by all means, feel free to throw in any other thoughts or considerations you may have.

Of course, having thought about this, I have my own ideas, but I'm curious to see if they coincide with yours.

rose

Sounds like Wichita Falls, TX, and I don't know what to grow successfully in this hell hole. If anything can be grown over in Africa maybe I can grow it here in Tomato Hell. I'll try to follow this thread.

[Wandering Rose]

Cushman,  but it's interesting that you picked up on the climate description. I intentionally used one that represents many of the 'food desert' locales in the Southwest, where there are no farms or farm stands for miles around, and often no grocery stores either and whatever limited variety of fresh produce can be bought in those stores, one you get to them, is either priced too high, or skipped over because of lack of refrigeration to keep it fresh. 

But as an EB Board Hero, surely you have found all sorts of ways to defeat the Witchie-Taw weather???

To those who missed the idea behind BPP and V%...never mind, it is just a thought I'm playing with to help people visualize EBs in terms of what they know or have been taught of the Sq. Ft. gardening methods.  If asked, today, I would guestimate that 3 EBs could provide a fresh salad every day for two people, if the plantings were staggered so that half of each box was in production and half in the replant stage. (Box 1: Tomato, Box 2: Pepper and Cuke, Box 3: Lettuce)

rose

[PaulB]

Ok, I understand the hypothetical situation that you are setting up for discussion, Rose.  Given the weather/rain scenario, and that the typical crops are beans and yams, I would recommend that the crops to be grown in the boxes be beans and peppers, not yams.  Yams, being a root vegetable, would not develop to any reasonable extent in the small depth/surface area of an earth box, whereas beans and peppers are well suited to the boxes, as are tomatos of course.  Many subtropical/desert cultures use both beans and peppers as staples in their diets, and thus the recommendation.  Some selected herbs and short-rooted crops such as onions would do well, also.

Earth boxes are well suited for water-conservation purposes, which I remind everyone locally when I get a chance.  Most desert areas have alkaline water, to boot, and slightly lower levels of dolomite might work best.

[Wandering Rose]

Paul, if the locals can grow yams and beans in their current conditions, then it seems to me that should be encouraged for the calorie value, and the EBs used for supplemental nutritional  gardening.

Thanks for the tip on the dolomite...we have alkaline water here and I've wondered if using the same mix in the same box for more than a season. wouldn't cause the ph to build to the point that chlorophyl lockout occurs. Lowering the initial dolomite level makes sense.

rose

[cushman350]

Cushman,  but it's interesting that you picked up on the climate description. I intentionally used one that represents many of the 'food desert' locales in the Southwest, where there are no farms or farm stands for miles around, and often no grocery stores either and whatever limited variety of fresh produce can be bought in those stores, one you get to them, is either priced too high, or skipped over because of lack of refrigeration to keep it fresh.  

But as an EB Board Hero, surely you have found all sorts of ways to defeat the Witchie-Taw weather???

To those who missed the idea behind BPP and V%...never mind, it is just a thought I'm playing with to help people visualize EBs in terms of what they know or have been taught of the Sq. Ft. gardening methods.  If asked, today, I would guestimate that 3 EBs could provide a fresh salad every day for two people, if the plantings were staggered so that half of each box was in production and half in the replant stage. (Box 1: Tomato, Box 2: Pepper and Cuke, Box 3: Lettuce)

rose

Don't know about the terminology of Hero, just been around a while.

I have tried humidity manipulation (misting) combined with shadecloth at peak heat of the day. Early planting and fall extension using plastic sheet and frame and electrical heat source and Mother[please wash my mouth out with soap] Beyach has kicked my Wichita Falls butt for the last 2 years. I took this year off, really. No active boxes. For days the wind has blown 25-30mph, 94-97°. What wants to grow in that anyway?

The only thing misting did was help keep the spider mites at bay. WF is hot and dry. It humidified their breeding area and they have to have hot and dry to successfully mate and make the second hatching when things are nearly too far gone to recover. I misted when morning moisture was gone, 9-10am for 2 hours and again every 2 hours until late afternoon and stop misting soon enough for the plants to dry before nighttime. Food for thought if you are in an arid climate and have spider mites and want to try non-chemical means. This is an arid climate stradegy, a no no in more humid zones b/c it would start all kinds of fungus.

[Wandering Rose]

Oh, Cushman, I feel for you.   I've 'quit' in disgust a time or two myself.

We have those  blasting winds from March-May, but they  stop eventually, Thank Dog.  Over the years, I've learned how to create and enhance the various microclimates  on our 1/3 acre.

We have a stand of clumping bamboo that partially blocks the SW winds. Though the canes get ten feet tall it does not spread much, probably because we never water it.  PM me if you want some roots.

I've also stacked cement blocks for  temporary windbreaks and put in a raised bed with three foot high walls. Half filled with potting mix, it leaves 18" of surrounding wall to  gave the plants shelter while they are young and tender.

And, yes, very few plants can take the strong sunlight that comes with our low humidity. Except for Okra. Its African origins make it an ideal hot weather crop. Like Sunflowers, it can be used for seasonal shade.

My current microclimate 'kluge' (built with the help of my husband) is butted up against the south wall of our house:

 

I slide the cover up and down, depending on how much shade I want.  Happily I have no neighbors to  object to  the looks of it.

Later in the season, I will put up a high shade sail between the house and the carport, and replace the stapled on plastic with screened panels that bolt on (if said husband can be co-erced into making them!),  But for now, the plastic surround seems to keep the box temperatures moderated so I don't have a large day/night swing.

So far, so good.  I  put tomato starts in the first week of March and seeded self-fertile zucchini sometime in April. I picked my first Tom from Kimberly a couple of weeks ago, and my first zucchini yesterday.  We'll see what the roasting season brings.

In the course of a year I expect to see a couple of grasshopers, cabbage loopers, aphids, hornworms, and flea beetles, all of which are manageable. LA gardeners were having enormous investations of harlequin beetles, but I so far I have missed them and the spider mites. I have a feeling your humitdy tent method might handle both problems, if they show up.

Also, you  probably know about Native Seeds and Seeds Trust, which specialize in varieties that are adapted to harsh conditions, but if you don't, check them out:

http://www.nativeseeds.org/
http://secure.seedstrust.com/

The Seeds Trust folks sold me on Urbikany tomatoes with their statement that that it did well as an early tomato for Tucson market gardeners. It is a short (we must have plants with low wind resistance! ) determinate variety, and though I haven't tasted it yet,  it is VERY productive.

Other crops that I think of as being adapted to our hot weather are containerized sweet potatoes. Melons. Collards.  Amaranth. New Zealand spinach.*

Whatever you do, don't quit!  But if you do, can I have your boxes? <g>

rose

*ETA  Asian long beans (54 DTM Stickless Wonder produces on short plants). Armenian Cukes. And probably anything grown in the middle east.